History: BPFK Section: Distance

General Section Issues

The rationale for using ZI and VA to tag the distance is that their function is precisely to indicate the measure of separation of the event from the speaker or reference point. There is no other convenient way of specifying the measure of separation, while there are plenty of other ways to indicate the reference point: for example PU, FAhA and KI.

Ancient usages with the "there at..." meaning are not contemplated. These are wrong both by CLL and by this proposal:

 
http://balance.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9104/msg00066.html

le cribe cu cupra lei kalci va le tricu ciste

All-of-the-at-least-one-thing-I-describe-as a-bear [past]
produced the-mass-of feces there-at the tree-type-of system.

The bear shat in the woods.

http://balance.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9608/msg00012.html

[English (by Guy Lee)]
; you, Tityrus, cool in shade,
Are teaching woods to echo lovely Amaryllis.

[Lojban]
.i do doi tityrus. noi nalkurji
va le ctino cu ctuca lei ricfoi fi lenu sance minra la poi melbi
.amarilis.

[English Don Wiggins]
; you, Titerus, who does not care, there in the shade,
teach the forests the echo of Amarili the Beautiful. [...]

http://balance.wiw.org/~jkominek/lojban/9305/msg00109.html

From: David Twery

.i mi pu tirna ko'a va le vacri po'e lo nicte ca mi tirna lenu lo mamta cu
selsanga co vrucau seva'u lo verba poi ke'a selraktu je fengu vi leka manku

I heard it in the air of one night when I listened to a mother
singing softly to a child restless and angry in the darkness.

The widespread use of "vi" instead of "bu'u" as the space equivalent of "ca" becomes invalidated. There are lots of these, here are just a few examples:

 

http://www.lojban.org/files/texts/mildew {vi lo purdi}, {vi loi cnino stuzi}, {vi le rokci}

http://www.lojban.org/files/texts/cukta2.html {vi lo minra}

http://www.lojban.org/files/texts/moser {vi le lisri}, {vi le dei jufygri}, {vi lo jibni be lo jufra fanmo}, {vi le ckana}

http://www.lojban.org/texts/translations/alice/alice.html {vi le selmacygu'e}

http://www.lojban.org/files/texts/ckafybarja/ckafybarja2 {vi le barja}, {vile ckafybarja}, {vi le tcadu}

tu'a le cukta {vi le tcadu}, {vi le klina}

http://www.lojban.org/files/texts/luther_king {vi le xunre cmama'a be la djordjas}, {vi le mu'a .ua la misisipis. jectypau}

http://www.lojban.org/files/texts/cukta3.html {vi le ckafybarja}, {vi le purci}

My version of The Book? {vi le loldi}, {vi le cukta fanmo}, {vi le kunti foldi}

le nanmu kujo'u le since {vi lei pagbu be le dinju}, {vi le me la ga'i drurin. zdani}, {vi le srasu}, {vi le midju darno}, {vi le na'e ciblu}, {vi le cukta kumfa}, {vi le dijlu'a}

http://www.lojban.org/files/texts/ckafybarja1 {vi le jupku'a}

http://www.lojban.org/files/texts/maxwell_tales {vi le galtu be lo zdani}, {vi le dizlo be le zdani}, {vi le zdani}

http://www.lojban.org/texts/translations/drbible/drbible_10.html {vi le barda cmana}, {vi le mipri pagbu be le cmana}, {vi lo xrulrlili'u}

Old MacDonald {vi le cange}

Some uses of "vi" with the "a short distance from..." meaning:

 

tu'a le cukta {vi le xekri je ctile rirxe}

le nanmu kujo'u le since {vi la nil}

http://www.lojban.org/files/texts/ckafybarja1 {vi le ragve kojna}

lapoi pelxu ku'o trajynobli {vi le remoi jubme}

Meeting other lojbanists {vi le se xabju be do}

Some uses that become validated

 

http://www.lojban.org/texts/translations/alice/alice_9.html {zi lo mokca}, {zi lo mentu be li ji'ire}, {zi lo mleca be lo temci}, {za lo drata mentu}

Le Petit Prince {za lo nanca be li xa}

Le Petit Prince 2? {vu lo minli be li ki'o}

http://www.lojban.org/texts/translations/alice/alice_7.html {va lo mitre be li su'o

http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/browse_thread/thread/1b8740eaa11bcd01
Disagreement/clarification/discussion on FAhA. (also in 'spatial' FAhA)

Poll