These are words that might be used pedagogically to mark these word types per http://teddyb.org/robin/Documentation+Standards+For+Lojban.
- (sumti/bridi-tail/general) afterthought logical connective, which we're just calling ALC
- We might want to come up with something better than "bridi-tail" there.
- needs a Lojban equivalent?
- some piece of documentation needs to specify what "general ALC" actually can connect
- (tanru/general) forethought logical connective (FLC)
- some piece of documentation needs to specify what "general FLC" actually can connect
- needs a Lojban equivalent?
Notes
- Should we do ijeks as well as jeks? That would simplify the jek definitions, but should we bother?
- Unlimited forethought connection would be really nice. This would need a new cmavo something like {bei}, for all but the last connection. So {ge ko'a gi ko'e} is unchanged, but {ge ko'a gi'oi ko'e gi ko'i} means the same as {ko'a .e ko'e .e ko'i}. {gi} marks "this is the last branch of the next-outer-most FLC".
- < ksion> Plus probably a terminator in case you forgot saying {gi} before the last argument. < ksion> (That's mostly for speech convienience though).
- Since all LC are theoretically syntactic sugar for {.i JA}, how to GOhA interact with them?
- Example: {ko'a brode gi'e broda} — what's {go'i} after that? {ko'a broda}? Or {ko'a brode gi'e broda} whatever that means as single bridi.
- Also {vo'A}. What does {ko'a broda ko'e gi'e brode ko'i vo'e} mean? Does {vo'e} refer to {ko'e} or {ko'i}?
- In most cases it probably should be "refers to the bridi it itself is embedded in".
- What is the meaning of SE + logical connective, when the SE is something other than {se}?
- There are gismu equivalents of A and E, but not O and U. This seems unfortunate. Does {nibli} count as an equiv of O?
- Speaking of which, what do {kanxe} and {vlina} actually mean? Is {le kanxe be ko'a bei ko'e cu broda} semantically equivalent to {ko'a .e ko'e cu broda}? If not, what *is* it semantically equivalent to?
- Yet another use/mention problem in the gismu. How many does that make?
- ksion in #lojban suggests: {la'e lu ko'a broda .ije ko'a brode li'u cu kanxe lo du'u ko'a broda kei lo du'u ko'a brode}, which is horrible; I (camgusmis) would rather redefine than be stuck with shit like that.
- {i lo du'u ge broda gi brode cu kanxe lo du'u broda kei lo du'u brode} from dbrock; same thing
- xorxes had a proposal that replaces all the logical connectives with JA, which is rather impressive. See http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/browse_thread/thread/131b44ba66d8a108/bac4b378caafbdeb
- All of the definitions need Lindar's touch - I mean, they need expanding into something more, um, conversational English. - .aionys., at prompting from arj.
- Order of operations for multiple sumti connectives in a bridi needs to be resolved. Is {ko'a .a ko'e broda fo'a .e fo'e} the same as {ko'a broda fo'a .e fo'e .i ja ko'e broda fo'a .e fo'e} (LtR) or is it {ko'a .a ko'e broda fo'a .i je ko'a .a ko'e broda fo'e} (RtL, which would be unusual, or if "and" takes precedence over "or", as in many formal systems)?
Impact
The current definitions are expected to have no particular impact;
they should just clarify the current state.
Proposed Definitions and Examples
cmavo: .a (A)
Proposed Definition
A sumti ALC such that the containing bridi is true if and only if it is true for at least one of the connected sumti.
See Also
- {.e}
- {.o}
- {.u}
- {ji}
- {vlina}
Proposed Keywords
- or (sumti ALC, inclusive)
- inclusive or (sumti ALC)
- and/or (sumti ALC)
Usage Examples
- .i ju'o la .alis. .a la .bab. djuno
- I’m sure Alice or Bob knows.
- .i mi na ponse lo jdini .a lo kacma
- I have neither money nor a camera.
cmavo: .e (A)
Proposed Definition
A sumti ALC such that the containing bridi is true if and only if it is true for each of the connected sumti.
See Also
- {.a}
- {.o}
- {.u}
- {ji}
- {kanxe}
Proposed Keywords
- and (sumti ALC)
- but (sumti ALC)
- both (sumti ALC)
Usage Examples
- .i makfa do .e nai mi
- Magic to you but not to me.
cmavo: .o (A)
Proposed Definition
A sumti ALC such that the containing bridi is true if and only if it is true for both or neither of the connected sumti.
See Also
Proposed Keywords:
- if and only if (sumti ALC)
- iff (sumti ALC)
- both or neither (sumti ALC)
Usage Examples
- .i mi djica tu'a lo jipci .o lo finpe
- I want chicken if and only if I want fish. (This might be implied in English anyway using "if" instead of "if and only if")
- .i mi .o la .alis. salci
- Alice and I will both celebrate, or neither of us will.
cmavo cluster: .o nai (A*)
Proposed Definition
A sumti ALC such that the containing bridi is true if and only if it is true for exactly one of the connected sumti.
See Also
- {.a}
- {.e}
- {.o}
- {.u}
- {ji}
- {nai}
Proposed Keywords:
- exclusive or (sumti ALC)
- or (sumti ALC, exclusive)
Usage Examples
- do onai lo drata ba pinxe
- Either you or another, but not both, will drink.
- do ca tadni lo samske .onai lo cmaci
- You are either studying computer science or math.
- do kakne lenu pilno le barda skami .onai le cmalu skami ku ma
- Under what conditions are you able to use either a big computer or a small computer, but not both?
cmavo: .u (A)
Proposed Definition
A sumti ALC such that the containing bridi is true if and only if it is true for the first of connected sumti.
See Also
Proposed Keywords:
- whether (sumti connective)
- whether or not (sumti connective)
- regardless (sumti connective)
- disregardless (sumti connective)
- irrespective (sumti connective)
- no matter (sumti connective)
- disregarding (sumti connective)
Usage Examples
- mi citka lo cirla .u lo nanba
- I eat cheese whether or not I eat bread.
- fanza mi u do
- That annoys me whether or not it annoys you.
- mi nelci la jbovlaste se .u nai la .noraluj.
- I like jbovlaste, or I like neither jbovlaste nor noralujv.
- .i mi djica tu'a lo jipci .u lo finpe
- I want chicken whether or not I want the fish.
cmavo: ji (A)
Proposed Definition
The sumti ALC question: asks the listener to supply a sumti ALC that makes the containing bridi true.
See Also
- {.a}
- {.e}
- {.o}
- {.u}
- {preti}
- {cuxna}
Proposed Keywords
Usage Examples
Note that "or" doesn't really capture the Lojban here very well, because any sumti ALC is legal here, but it's about the best we can do.
- .i do pinxe lo ckafi ji lo tcati .i na .e
- Are you drinking coffee or tea? — The latter.
- .i doi .bancus. pau le cmene be do cu srana lo'u ban cus le'u ji zo bancu
- Bancus, is your name related to “ban cus†or to “bancu�
cmavo: ga (GA)
Proposed Definition
A general FLC such that the containing statement is true if and only if it is true for at least one of the connected phrases.
See Also
- {ge}
- {go}
- {gu}
- {ge'i}
- {gi}
- {vlina}
Proposed Keywords
- or (general FLC, inclusive)
- inclusive or (general FLC)
- and/or (general FLC)
Usage Examples
- ga le jintyke'a cu mutce le ka condi gi abu mutce le ka masno le nu farlu
- Either the well was very deep or Alice was falling very slowly.
- .ue sai ga mi xamgu se funca gi ti na mutce vlipa
- Either I'm lucky, or that's not very powerful, or both.
- .i .u'u ga lo se cpedu cu na cumki gi do snada lo nu cfipu mi
- I'm sorry, either that request is not possible, or you've succeeded at confusing me, or both.
cmavo: ge (GA)
Proposed Definition
A general FLC such that the containing statement is true if and only if it is true for both of the connected phrases.
See Also
- {ga}
- {go}
- {gu}
- {ge'i}
- {gi}
- {kanxe}
Proposed Keywords
- and (general FLC)
- but (general FLC)
- both (general FLC)
Usage Examples
- abu tolmorji le nu ge abu ca kilto la ractu le ka barda giseki'ubo noda krinu le nu terpa ry
- Alice forgot that she was a thousand times bigger than Rabbit and therefore had no reason to fear it.
- la .zim. la .gr. ge mulno se selfu gi minde lo za'i morsi
- Zim is completely the master of Gr, and commands Gr to cause death.
cmavo: go (GA)
Proposed Definition
A general FLC such that the containing statement is true if and only if it is true for both or neither of the connected phrases.
See Also
- {ga}
- {ge}
- {gu}
- {gi}
- {ge'i}
Proposed Keywords
- if and only if (general FLC)
- iff (general FLC)
- both or neither (general FLC)
Usage Examples
- go mi na ponse lo cidja gi mi nitcu lonu klama lo cidrjpitsa zarci
- I need to go to the pizza store if and only if I don't have any food.
- ro da ro de zo'u go da de mamta gi da fetsi gi'e rirni de
- For all X and Y, X is the mother of Y if and only if X is female and reared Y.
- .i'e go tolju'i gi ju'o ru'e cliva
- Yeah, if [you're] ignoring [us?], [you] should maybe leave.
cmavo cluster: go nai (GA*)
Proposed Definition
A general FLC such that the containing statement is true if and only if it is true for exactly one of the connected phrases.
See Also
- {ga}
- {ge}
- {go}
- {gu}
- {gi}
- {ge'i}
- {nai}
Proposed Keywords
- exclusive or (sumti ALC)
- or (sumti ALC, exclusive)
Usage Examples
- gonai do sarji mi gi do sarji lo sonci
- You're either with us or with the soldiers.
- gonai mi dunda le cidja gi le bifce ba nelci mi
- Either I give food or the bees won't like me.
- gonai vi mi snime carvi gi mi fenki
- Either it's snowing here or I'm crazy.
cmavo: gu (GA)
Proposed Definition
A general FLC such that the containing statement is true if and only if it is true for the first of the connected phrases.
See Also
- {ga}
- {ge}
- {go}
- {gi}
- {ge'i}
Proposed Keywords
- whether (sumti FLC)
- whether or not (sumti FLC)
- regardless (sumti FLC)
- disregardless (sumti FLC)
- irrespective (sumti FLC)
- no matter (sumti FLC)
- disregarding (sumti FLC)
Usage Examples
- .i .ia mi pu na'e sanji krici lo du'u se gu li'a mutce xamgu gi la'a na'e mutce zdile ja cinri
- I think I was unconsciously believing that, whether or not it was clearly very good, it probably wasn’t very amusing or interesting.
- .i gu srana gi to'e melbi
- It's relevant, whether or not it's ugly.
- lo nu do kakne lo nu ciksi bau la .lojban. cu se gu nandu gi se jgira ko
- Being able to explain it in Lojban should, whether or not it is difficult, make you feel pride.
cmavo: ge'i (GA)
Proposed Definition
The general FLC question: asks the listener to supply a FLC that makes the containing statement true.
See Also
- {ga}
- {ge}
- {go}
- {gu}
- {gi}
- {preti}
- {cuxna}
Proposed Keywords
- or (general FLC, question)
Usage Examples
Note that "or" doesn't really capture the Lojban very well, because any general FLC
is legal here, but it's about the best we can do.
- do zanru ge'i lo du'u na pinka gi lo mi gunka stuzi
- Do you approve of me not commenting or of my workplace?
- doi .timos. la .xongcun. cu ge'i du le de'u pendo be do gi jimpe fi dei
- Tim, is xongcun the friend of yours you just mentioned or capable of understanding this?
- la cizra ge'i cizra gi ninmu
- Is Cizra strange or a woman?
cmavo: gi'a (GIhA)
Proposed Definition
A bridi-tail ALC such that the containing bridi is true if and only if it is true for at least one of the connected bridi tails.
See Also
- {gi'e}
- {gi'o}
- {gi'u}
- {gi'i}
Proposed Keywords
- or (bridi-tail ALC, inclusive)
- inclusive or (bridi-tail ALC)
- and/or (bridi-tail ALC)
Usage Examples
- ko zifre ba'e gi'a morsi
- Be free or die! Or both!
- mu'a fi ko cfika gi'a pemci
- For example, you should write fiction or poetry, or both.
- ma nuzba gi'a se zukte do doi timonator
- What's new or being done by you, Timonator?
cmavo: gi'e (GIhA)
Proposed Definition
A bridi-tail ALC such that the containing bridi is true if and only if it is true for both of the connected bridi tails.
See Also
- {gi'a}
- {gi'o}
- {gi'u}
- {gi'i}
Proposed Keywords
- and (sumti ALC)
- but (sumti ALC)
- both (sumti ALC)
Usage Examples
- baziku la alis mo'ine'i jersi ry gi'e noroi pensi le du'u ta'iba'e makau abu ba za'ure'u bartu
- Shortly, Alice chased R inside, and never thought about how she would get out again.
- mi sanli gi'e cortu lo xadni trixe
- I stand and feel pain in the back of my body.
- le i'u dargu cu clani gi'e jai nandu
- The familiar road is long and difficult.
cmavo: gi'o (GIhA)
Proposed Definition
A bridi-tail ALC such that the containing bridi is true if and only if it is true for both or neither of the connected bridi tails.
See Also
- {gi'a}
- {gi'e}
- {gi'u}
- {gi'i}
Proposed Keywords
- if and only if (bridi-tail ALC)
- iff (bridi-tail ALC)
- both or neither (bridi-tail ALC)
Usage Examples
- fasnu gi'o pixra
- Pics or it didn't happen.
- ro da danlu gi'o se cidja
- Everything is an animal and everything is edible, or neither.
- mi rivbi tu'a le glibau gi'o tavla lo jbopre
- I avoid English and I talk to Lojbanists, or neither.
cmavo cluster: gi'o nai (GIhA*)
Proposed Definition
A bridi-tail ALC such that the containing bridi is true if and only if it is true for exactly one of the connected bridi tails.
See Also
- {gi'a}
- {gi'e}
- {gi'o}
- {gi'u}
- {gi'i}
- {nai}
Proposed Keywords
- exclusive or (sumti ALC)
- or (sumti ALC, exclusive)
Usage Examples
- pe'a le merko ca blanu gi'o nai xunre
- Speaking figuratively, an American is now either Red or Blue.
- .e'u nai sai zgana gi'o nai gunka
- Careful! Observation or work, not both.
- sipna gi'onai mrobi'o co'o
- Sleep or death. Bye!
cmavo: gi'u (GIhA)
Proposed Definition
A bridi-tail ALC such that the containing bridi is true if and only if it is true for the first of the connected bridi tails.
See Also
- {gi'a}
- {gi'e}
- {gi'o}
- {gi'i}
Proposed Keywords
- whether (sumti FLC)
- whether or not (sumti FLC)
- regardless (sumti FLC)
- disregardless (sumti FLC)
- irrespective (sumti FLC)
- no matter (sumti FLC)
- disregarding (sumti FLC)
Usage Examples
- se jimpe gi'u drani
- That's comprehensible, whether or not it's correct.
- zo je zmadu zo .e le ka xamgu gi'u gendra
- "je" is better than ".e", whether or not "je" is grammatically correct.
- do skicu gi'u sanji vau la .samxarmuj.
- You are describing samxarmuj, whether or not you're aware of samxarmuj's existence.
cmavo: gi'i (GIhA)
Proposed Definition
The bridi-tail ALC question: asks the listener to supply a bridi-tail ALC that makes the containing bridi true.
See Also
- {gi'a}
- {gi'e}
- {gi'o}
- {gi'u}
- {preti}
- {cuxna}
Proposed Keywords
- or (bridi-tail ALC, question)
Usage Examples
Note that "or" doesn't really capture the Lojban very well, because any
bridi-tail ALC is legal here, but it's about the best we can do.
- pe'u doi ninmu ti nuzlo gi'i sralo
- Please, miss, is this New Zealand or Australia?
- do djica lo nu ba tavla la .deivid. gi'i ca tavla lo drata
- Do you want to talk to David later or someone else now?
- do speni gi'i se panzi
- Are you married or a parent?
cmavo: gu'a (GUhA)
Proposed Definition
A tanru FLC such that the containing bridi is true if and only if it is true for at least one of the connected phrases.
See Also
- {gu'e}
- {gu'o}
- {gu'u}
- {gu'i}
Proposed Keywords
- or (tanru FLC, inclusive)
- inclusive or (tanru FLC)
- and/or (tanru FLC)
Usage Examples
The only usage in the wild we could find:
- .a'o la .nukis. gu'a nai troci gi na'e snada lo nu fanva di'u
- I hope that nukis either does not try or other-than-succeeds at translating that.
- mi gu'a jukpa gi citka lo sanmi
- I either cook or eat the meal or both.
cmavo: gu'e (GUhA)
Proposed Definition
A tanru FLC such that the containing bridi is true if and only if it is true for both of the connected phrases.
See Also
- {gu'a}
- {gu'o}
- {gu'u}
- {gu'i}
Proposed Keywords
- and (tanru FLC)
- but (tanru FLC)
- both (tanru FLC)
Usage Examples
- .ie gu'e smuni gi nai gerna dunli
- I agree, meaningful but not grammatically equivalent.
- mi gu'e jmive gi xabju
- I both live and dwell somewhere.
cmavo: gu'o (GUhA)
Proposed Definition
A tanru FLC such that the containing bridi is true if and only if it is true for both or neither of the connected phrases.
See Also
- {gu'a}
- {gu'e}
- {gu'u}
- {gu'i}
Proposed Keywords
- if and only if (tanru-internal FLC)
- iff (tanru-internal FLC)
- both or neither (tanru-internal FLC)
Usage Examples
- terpa gu'o lo za'i terpa
- ( ! sole usage, incorrect ! )
- .i mi nelci lo karce noi gu'o blanu gi xunre
- I like cars which are any colour that isn't blue or red, unless it's blue and red simultaneously.
cmavo cluster: gu'o nai (GUhA*)
Proposed Definition
A tanru FLC such that the containing bridi is true if and only if it is true for exactly one of the connected phrases.
See Also
- {gu'a}
- {gu'e}
- {gu'o}
- {gu'u}
- {gu'i}
- {nai}
Proposed Keywords
- exclusive or (tanru-internal FLC)
- or (tanru-internal FLC)
Usage Examples
- .i ko gu'o nai gasnu gi na gasnu .i lo nu troci na zasti
- Do or do not. There is no try.
cmavo: gu'u (GUhA)
Proposed Definition
A tanru FLC such that the containing bridi is true if and only if it is true for the first of the connected phrases.
See Also
- {gu'a}
- {gu'e}
- {gu'o}
- {gu'i}
Proposed Keywords
- whether (sumti connective)
- whether or not (sumti connective)
- regardless (sumti connective)
- disregardless (sumti connective)
- irrespective (sumti connective)
- no matter (sumti connective)
- disregarding (sumti connective)
Usage Examples
( ! no natural usage ! )
- .i mi gu'u dasni be lo kosta be'o gi lenku
- I wear a coat whether or not I am cold.
cmavo: gu'i (GUhA)
Proposed Definition
The tanru FLC question: asks the listener to supply a tanru FLC that makes the containing bridi true.
See Also
- {gu'a}
- {gu'e}
- {gu'o}
- {gu'u}
- {preti}
- {cuxna}
Proposed Keywords
Usage Examples
Note that "or" doesn't really capture the Lojban here very well, because any tanru FLC is legal here, but it's about the best we can do.
- .i pau do te cukta gu'i te skina
- Are you a book-author or a film creator?
cmavo: gi (GI)
Proposed Definition
Seperates the first from the second clause in a general FLC construct.
Converts a non-logical connective into a coordinating conjunction.
See Also
- {ga}
- {ge}
- {go}
- {gu}
- {ge'i}
Proposed Keywords
None; there's nothing like this in English except maybe comma.
Someone suggested:
- coordinating, connective, conjunction, medial
but but those are mentions, not uses; that is: no-one is going to look up "medial" in a dictionary and be happy that they found "gi", since it doesn't mean "medial", or anything like it.
Usage Examples
- ge nai lo xanto gi nai lo smacu cu xunryblabi
- Neither an elephant nor a mouse is pink.
- ganai mi gunka lo valsi gi mi zmanei la rubis.
- If I'm working on words, then I prefer Ruby. (Discussion on programming languages)
- mi ge cliva gi .ai xrukla
- I'm leaving, and I intend to come back.
- .i ku'i pu za tavla fi joi gi lo skina gi lo skami
- But were talking about both movies and computers
Notes
- "coordinating conjunction"? Is that correct? What doet that mean?
- What about the keywords?
cmavo: ja (JA)
Proposed Definition
A general ALC such that the containing statement is true if and only if it is true for at least one of the connected phrases.
See Also
- {je}
- {jo}
- {ju}
- {je'i}
- {vlina}
Proposed Keywords
- or (general ALC, inclusive)
- inclusive or (general ALC)
- and/or (general ALC)
Usage Examples
- ji'a ma prali sei la alis pensi fi lo cukta poi vasru no pixra ja nuncasnu
- And what is the use, thought Alice, of a book with no pictures or conversations (or both) in it?
- la norsmu so'i roi prije ja pemci cusku
- Norsmu many times expresses wise or poetic (or both) things.
- .u'i nai lo crida na kakne lo nu jimpe ja cusku bau la lojban
- *sigh* Monsters are not able to undertand or speak Lojban.
- do cizra .ija mi bebna
- You're strange. Or I'm foolish. Or both.
Notes
- May be combined with PU to indicate multiple tenses.
cmavo: je (JA)
Proposed Definition
A general ALC such that the containing statement is true if and only if it is true for both of the connected phrases.
See Also
- {ja}
- {jo}
- {ju}
- {je'i}
- {kanxe}
Proposed Keywords
- and (general ALC)
- but (general ALC)
- both (general ALC)
Usage Examples
- ku'i co'a bajra ca le nu djica ije co'u bajra ca la nu djica
- But start walking when you want. And stop walking when you want.
- clani je cizra cmene
- That's a long and strange name.
- pu troci je ku'i .o'unai fliba lo zmadu
- We tried but, unfortunately, failed to do more.
- .i ro ko ca je ba gleki .a'o
- "Everybody be happy and keep being happy!"
- ko pilno la mymbl pu je ba lonu litru
- "Use Mumble before and after travelling."
- le pu je ba nolraitru
- "The once and future king!"
- mi pu je ca ca'o citka lei grasu patlu
- "I was an am now in the process of eating the greasy potatoes."
Notes
- May be combined with PU to indicate multiple tenses.
cmavo: jo (JA)
Proposed Definition
A general ALC such that the containing statement is true if and only if it is true for both or neither of the connected phrases.
See Also
Proposed Keywords
- if and only if (general ALC)
- iff (general ALC)
- both or neither (general ALC)
Usage Examples
FIXME:
- .ei troci jubo snada jo cilre
- Either I try (whether or not I succeed) and learn, or neither.
- da prenu jo nelci be lo'e mlatu
- Either something is a person and likes cats, or neither.
- mi kakne lo nu viska .i jo mi na sipna
- Either I am able to look and I am not asleep, or neither.
Notes
- May be combined with PU to indicate multiple tenses.
cmavo cluster: jo nai (JA*)
Proposed Definition
A general ALC such that the containing statement is true if and only if it is true for exactly one of the connected phrases.
See Also
- {ja}
- {je}
- {jo}
- {ju}
- {je'i}
- {nai}
Proposed Keywords
- exclusive or (general ALC)
- or (general ALC, exclusive)
Usage Examples
- ko stali le'o .i jo nai gau mi fagri le do zdani
- Stop, or I'll set your house on fire!
- do vitke la jbonunsla .i jo nai mabla do
- Come to jbonunsla or you suck.
- ko sutra cadzu .i jo nai do ba farlu
- Walk quickly, or you will fall!
cmavo: ju (JA)
Proposed Definition
A general ALC such that the containing statement is true if and only if it is true for the first of the connected phrases.
See Also
Proposed Keywords
- whether (general connective)
- whether or not (general connective)
- regardless (general connective)
- disregardless (general connective)
- irrespective (general connective)
- no matter (general connective)
- disregarding (general connective)
Usage Examples
- ge mi di'i nai bilma gi ji'a mi di'i nai jibri gunki .i ju mi gleki
- I'm sometimes sick and also I somtimes work. Whether or not I'm happy.
- .i ke'u mi cakla .i se ju bo mi curmi lo nu do citka mi
- Repeating: I'm chocolate, whether or not I allow you to eat me.
- drani ju vrude
- True, whether or not virtuous.
Notes
- May be combined with PU to indicate multiple tenses.
cmavo: je'i (JA)
Proposed Definition
The general ALC question: asks the listener to supply a general ALC that makes the containing statement true.
See Also
- {ja}
- {je}
- {jo}
- {ju}
- {preti}
- {cuxna}
Proposed Keywords
- or (general ALC, question)
Usage Examples
- ro valsi poi pu'i je'i ka'e se pilno
- All words can be or have been used?
- skina je'i se tivni
- Movie or television?
- do bruna je'i mensi mi doi lindar
- Are you my brother or sister, Lindar?
Notes
- May be combined with PU to indicate multiple tenses.
Relevant prior discussions
Syntax
http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/browse_thread/thread/575ef0d0130f5dfa/fbc21c895ea7e7db
A parser bug that causes li revo .a li pare to not be recognized, because it needs LALR(2).
http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/browse_thread/thread/131b44ba66d8a108/bac4b378caafbdeb
Unification of all logical connectives into selma'o JA.
Proposal to allow FLC tanru conn inside of gadri. (this already seems to work by some parsers)
http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/browse_thread/thread/29ca7d8d4ac7b045/47216c973d48c8ae
A proposal for a new “narrative connectiveâ€.
http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/browse_thread/thread/654fd661714280ab/d86c7be1eaea0f6c
A proposal for adding GI+JOI as a gihek.
http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/browse_thread/thread/4b186a2b0ee97300/6ff8942d86acdf3b
NUhU_gap as a cheat to avoid having more logical connectives.
http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/browse_thread/thread/c5c29b58f5b55844/b066953d785461c5
Proposal: allow jeks wherever joiks are allowed
http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/browse_thread/thread/417d12c084a1f1b1/58c543b6edd9c5bb
A Zipfean argument against making ji the tanru afterthought connective question
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/jboske/message/3026
Inconsistent order of logical connectives with different types of tags
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/jboske/message/2665
Inconsistency in the syntax of tanru-internal forethought logical connectives
http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/browse_thread/thread/93fb5ae01c9004d2/5c32c8805e30dadf
A change proposal so that geks can be used in both bridi-tails and sentences.
Semantics
http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/browse_thread/thread/9a6093d2f3b8fc1c/db7aeb8673367cc9
Whether or not jeks in tanru in description sumti can be expanded to eks between sumti.
http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/browse_thread/thread/74ebb9b641d29581/da2e404d84be9713
What is the meaning of SE + logical connective, when the SE is something other than se?
http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/browse_thread/thread/d16e34b4b7a6b86d/1218a918bc69ff13
All logical connectives expand to bridi logical connection.
http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/browse_thread/thread/fb116c898bffaf40/bd23fe39e5ea494e
On the relationship between logical connectives and quantifiers.
http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/browse_thread/thread/648a3ad2bf6d5a4c/69788377c36fc3a4
In tense constructs, what binds more tightly of connectives or modifiers?
http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/browse_thread/thread/411b216008b6bc2e/cb1f5031b8b8c301
How do logical connectives interact with intensional descriptions?
http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/browse_thread/thread/68ea52479af6de13/f181255b8a32e345
SE + logical connective, when the SE is something other than se, is nonsense
http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/browse_thread/thread/928ecca8e7cab2a0/d25e56fc00f677c6
How do quantified tenses work when they tag a sumti with logical connectives?
http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/browse_thread/thread/f118dc3d365bef06/a58f848ee6a9c0dd
How do logical connectives interact with intensional descriptions?
http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/browse_thread/thread/1d9caabd2b8abc3/0e21d7388838e537
The use of da'i in hypothetical implications
Scope
http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/browse_thread/thread/f93bfd5b099a3487/2797d3b6427230d3
Do variables scope over logical connectives?
http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/browse_thread/thread/14b46750fb6f29a4/e39efe9efead6469
How far does the scope of a prenex extend?
http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/browse_thread/thread/860de16cdfa5222e/963d9a1f874f313f
http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/browse_thread/thread/60ba8c5338249aee/99bd5da231aef65d
http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/browse_thread/thread/c246dc4fe8d77681/218f03984b1085ff
http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/browse_thread/thread/792da8bce6712834/6dfc1081a1b7d907
Imperative connectives. What is the Lojban translation of “Stop, or I'll shoot� Do imperatives scope over ijeks?
http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/browse_thread/thread/6d04858f0ee8153b/e08e347f0d2b66a9
zo'e doesn't preserve identity across logical connectives.
Distribution/expansion
http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/browse_thread/thread/9a6093d2f3b8fc1c/db7aeb8673367cc9
Distribution of connectives in tanru
http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/browse_thread/thread/490556aeccff6444/296d026d3ccc0710
Distribution of sumti logical connectives
http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/browse_thread/thread/84f40bcff10a6955/51747f4034c8110e
Distribution of tanru modification over logical connectives
http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/browse_thread/thread/cb26a0e38c54dab8/d38cd375b2298397
Distribution of sumti logical connectives
http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/browse_thread/thread/9a6093d2f3b8fc1c/21750dfb5f267039
Distributive or non-distributive grouping of tanru-internal logical connectives
http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/browse_thread/thread/1f589af7e00ce19a/7f7cac5a3d73981c
Logical connectives can't expand out of abstractions, which are referentially opaque
http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/browse_thread/thread/5eca5ed131b1a814/e026184d79ff8fb8
Tense logical connection is expandable
http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/browse_thread/thread/490556aeccff6444/d3c617d936314822
What is the correct expansion of a bridi where multiple of the arguments have logical connectives?
Other Crap
General Notes
- We need a way to easily say "would you like cream or sugar or a donut?" using ji or similar. I *think* this is straightforward, but this is a note to think about it.
There was a recent discussion of this that had people present their different solutions. There are two types: the one with {ji} and the ones with choice from a set.
do djica A ji B ji C ...
The helpful answers can all be covered with "(na).e(nai) .e(nai) ..."
A B zo'u do djica ma
do djica ma poi cmima A ce B ce C ce ...
do djica ma poi me A .a B .a C .a ...
The answers "A", "B", "C", ..., "A joi B", ... "noda", "roda". And if you want to be less than helpful: "pada", "su'oda", "me'ida", and so on.
- How do you reply to {do djica lo ladru ji nai lo sakta} if you want both? Again, might be obvious/well understood, but could use checking.
According to xorxes and mark shoulson (in the thread linked above) the answer is .eja'ai, using {ja'ai} aka the cmavo affirmer.
- what does {mi djica lo ladru .e nai lo sakta na .e lo titnanba} mean (double negative)?