Lojban In General

Posted by kpreid on Sat 05 of Dec, 2009 12:57 GMT posts: 7

On Oct 22, 2009, at 8:53, Remo Dentato wrote:

> - the dot of {.i} is enlarged by x% or rendered in bold

I think this is not a good choice. Firstly, "i" is the separator word;
the dot is is incidental. Secondly, having emphasized separators would
produce visual noise which would distract from the rest of the text.
If anything, ".i" should be lightly deemphasized, made slightly more
like a piece of whitespace.

--
Kevin Reid <http://switchb.org/kpreid/>

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Posted by PierreAbbat on Sat 05 of Dec, 2009 12:57 GMT posts: 324

On Thursday 22 October 2009 08:53:42 Remo Dentato wrote:
> - if not omitted, {fa'e} must be typeset on a separated line

You mean {fa'o}, right? {fa'e} is a preposition indicating something backward.

Pierre
--
.i toljundi do .ibabo mi'afra tu'a do
.ibabo damba do .ibabo do jinga
.icu'u la ma'atman.

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Posted by remod on Sat 05 of Dec, 2009 12:57 GMT posts: 39

> On Thursday 22 October 2009 08:53:42 Remo Dentato wrote:
>>     - if not omitted, {fa'e} must be typeset on a separated line
>
> You mean {fa'o}, right? {fa'e} is a preposition indicating something backward.

Yep. Sorry about that.

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On Thu, 22 Oct 2009, Remo Dentato wrote:

> coi jbopre
>
> I typeset and printed "lo nu binxo", translated by xorxes, for reading
> it when I'm away from a computer.

I saw the pictures, and it looks very nice.

> I've not found any suggestion for typesetting lojban so I thought we
> could put together something.

This should probably go on the wiki.

> For example:
> - {ni'o} always starts a new paragraph
> - {.i} never appears at the end of a line by itself

I agree with nonbreaking space after {.i}. It's probably also a good idea to
put nonbreaking space after sumtcita and LE. I've also toyed with (and found
that I rather liked) using thin spaces inside cmavo clusters. It forms a nice
compromise between the styles of using no space and normal spaces.

> - {.i} is surrounded by x% more space
> - the dot of {.i} is enlarged by x% or rendered in bold
> - Capter, Sections, subsections etc are numbered using more than
> one {pi} : "1.2.5 ..." {ni'o papirepimu ...}
> - footnotes should be ....???
> - bullet lists ???
> - if not omitted, {fa'e} must be typeset on a separated line
> - ...
>
> I'm not suggestion a "Chicago Manual of style", but just some common
> rules we all can agree.
>
> Of course, once agreed, we would need some good examples to show.
>
> I think it would be good to be able to show well-looking lojban books.
>
> remod
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to lojban-list-request@lojban.org
> with the subject unsubscribe, or go to http://www.lojban.org/lsg2/, or if
> you're really stuck, send mail to secretary@lojban.org for help.
>

--
Adam Lopresto
http://cec.wustl.edu/~adam/

Linux isn't perfect, but we're working on it.
--Alan Cox

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Posted by adamgarrigus on Sat 05 of Dec, 2009 12:57 GMT posts: 92

On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 10:16 AM, Adam D. Lopresto <adam@pubcrawler.org>wrote:

> On Thu, 22 Oct 2009, Remo Dentato wrote:
>
> - {.i} never appears at the end of a line by itself
>>
>
> I agree with nonbreaking space after {.i}. It's probably also a good idea
> to
> put nonbreaking space after sumtcita and LE.

I understand the former (without agreeing), but I'm not seeing the upside in
the latter. Nothing particularly special about sumtcita & LE.

>
>
> - Capter, Sections, subsections etc are numbered using more than
>> one {pi} : "1.2.5 ..." {ni'o papirepimu ...}
>>
>
That's handled by {pi'e} rather than {pi}.

mu'o mi'e komfo,amonan

Posted by lukebergen on Sat 05 of Dec, 2009 12:57 GMT posts: 493

What pictures are these? Can I see?

On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 10:16 AM, Adam D. Lopresto <adam@pubcrawler.org>wrote:

> On Thu, 22 Oct 2009, Remo Dentato wrote:
>
> coi jbopre
>>
>> I typeset and printed "lo nu binxo", translated by xorxes, for reading
>> it when I'm away from a computer.
>>
>
> I saw the pictures, and it looks very nice.
>
>
> I've not found any suggestion for typesetting lojban so I thought we
>> could put together something.
>>
>
> This should probably go on the wiki.
>
>
> For example:
>> - {ni'o} always starts a new paragraph
>> - {.i} never appears at the end of a line by itself
>>
>
> I agree with nonbreaking space after {.i}. It's probably also a good idea
> to
> put nonbreaking space after sumtcita and LE. I've also toyed with (and
> found
> that I rather liked) using thin spaces inside cmavo clusters. It forms a
> nice
> compromise between the styles of using no space and normal spaces.
>
>
> - {.i} is surrounded by x% more space
>> - the dot of {.i} is enlarged by x% or rendered in bold
>> - Capter, Sections, subsections etc are numbered using more than
>> one {pi} : "1.2.5 ..." {ni'o papirepimu ...}
>> - footnotes should be ....???
>> - bullet lists ???
>> - if not omitted, {fa'e} must be typeset on a separated line
>> - ...
>>
>> I'm not suggestion a "Chicago Manual of style", but just some common
>> rules we all can agree.
>>
>> Of course, once agreed, we would need some good examples to show.
>>
>> I think it would be good to be able to show well-looking lojban books.
>>
>> remod
>>
>>
>> To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to
>> lojban-list-request@lojban.org
>> with the subject unsubscribe, or go to http://www.lojban.org/lsg2/, or if
>> you're really stuck, send mail to secretary@lojban.org for help.
>>
>>
> --
> Adam Lopresto
> http://cec.wustl.edu/~adam/ <http://cec.wustl.edu/%7Eadam/>
>
> Linux isn't perfect, but we're working on it.
> --Alan Cox
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to lojban-list-request@lojban.org
> with the subject unsubscribe, or go to http://www.lojban.org/lsg2/, or if
> you're really stuck, send mail to secretary@lojban.org for help.
>
>

Posted by remod on Sat 05 of Dec, 2009 12:57 GMT posts: 39

On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 5:09 PM, komfo,amonan <komfoamonan@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>     - Capter, Sections, subsections etc are numbered using more than
>>> one {pi} : "1.2.5 ..." {ni'o papirepimu ...}
>
> That's handled by {pi'e} rather than {pi}.

So "1.2.5 The Lojban language"

would be: {ni'o pi pi'e re pi'e mo'o mo'i le jbobau} ?

It's more correct but aesthetically less pleasent (IMHO).

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Posted by remod on Sat 05 of Dec, 2009 12:57 GMT posts: 39

On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 5:14 PM, Luke Bergen <lukeabergen@gmail.com> wrote:
> What pictures are these?  Can I see?

Just 4 pictures: http://picasaweb.google.com/rdentato/LoNuBinxo

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Posted by remod on Sat 05 of Dec, 2009 12:57 GMT posts: 39

On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 3:13 PM, Kevin Reid <kpreid@mac.com> wrote:
> On Oct 22, 2009, at 8:53, Remo Dentato wrote:
>
>>   - the dot of {.i} is enlarged by x% or rendered in bold
>
>
> I think this is not a good choice. Firstly, "i" is the separator word; the
> dot is is incidental. Secondly, having emphasized separators would produce
> visual noise which would distract from the rest of the text. If anything,
> ".i" should be lightly deemphasized, made slightly more like a piece of
> whitespace.

Well, the point is to create visual clues for the eye.

When I try to understand a lojban sentence (possibly three lines long
as there are some in the PDF:
http://sites.google.com/site/jboremod/cll/lonubinxo.pdf) I scan it
multiple times with the eyes to identify the bridi, the sumti etc. I
needed something to help me immediately identify when I could stop
scanning. I've tried to add a lot of space around {,i}, to bold it,
to make it larger, to make it smaller etc. In the end I opted for
enlarging.

I speak for myself here, of course, my intent is exactly to determine
what good typography rules could be for lojban.

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Posted by remod on Sat 05 of Dec, 2009 12:57 GMT posts: 39

On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 5:17 PM, Remo Dentato <rdentato@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 5:09 PM, komfo,amonan <komfoamonan@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>     - Capter, Sections, subsections etc are numbered using more than
>>>> one {pi} : "1.2.5 ..." {ni'o papirepimu ...}
>>
>> That's handled by {pi'e} rather than {pi}.
>
> So   "1.2.5 The Lojban language"
>
> would be: {ni'o pi pi'e re pi'e mo'o mo'i le jbobau}  ?

Sorry I meant: {ni'o pi pi'e re pi'e mu mo'o le jbobau}

Could this be a case when the numbers should be written using digits
rather then their lojban form?

ry

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