History: ''Gismu'' Agentive And Non-Agentive

Source of version: 3 (current)

As ((pne|I)) understand it, the practice of distinguishing between agent (ergative) and non-agent (absolutive), rather than between nonpatient (nominative) and patient (accusative) as is common in Indo-European languages. For a '''very''' brief overview of different case-marking systems, see [http://www.xibalba.demon.co.uk/jbr/ranto/r.html] -- part of a rant against Esperanto, but you can ignore that here; this appendix focuses only on cases. Ergative languages use approach (E) in his list. ''How do we express this in Lojban? gausmi?'' * ''gernrgativiti'' --((And)) (mi stidi) Unfortunately English not always marks this distinction (e.g. "return", the infamous keyword of ''xruti'')... See ((Ergativity)). !Non-Agentive form & it's corresponding Agentive: || cfari | begins | cfagau | initiates denpa | pauses | depygau | delays tolcfa | comes to a stop | sisti/dicra | halts/interrupts) sezyxru | reverts | xruti | restores cenba | varies | cenbygau/cnegau | alters jelca | burns | jelgau | ignites snura | is secure | bandu | protects masno | is slow | snogau/jabre | retards/brakes) muvdu | moves | muvgau | causes to move mrobi'o | dies | catra | kills banro | develops | banrygau | nurtures zenba | increases | zengau | augments banzu | suffices | bazgau | fulfills culno | is full | tisna | fills basti | takes the place of | basygau | replaces klama | goes | bevri | conveys bilma | is sick | bilmygau | sickens bredi | is ready | redgau | prepares carna | turns | cargau | rotates selcfipu | is confused | cfipu | confuses cilre | learns | ctuca | teaches ckeji | feels ashamed | kejgau | humiliates kakne | is able | curmi | allows curve | is pure | cuvgau | purifies danfu | is an answer | dafsku/frati | replies drani | is correct | dragau | rectifies farlu | falls | falgau | drops fatne | is backwards | fatygau | reverses febvi | comes to a boil | fabgau | boils porpi | comes apart | popygau | breaks fukpi | is a copy | fukyzba | duplicates gacri | is a cover | gairgau | covers over ganlo | is closed | ganlygau | closes gusni | illumines | gusygau | illuminates jdika | contracts | jdikygau | decreases jinru | bathes | jirgau | immerses jorne | is joined to | jongau | connects katna | cutter | katnygau | cuts burcu | brush | bruzu'e | paints komcu | is a comb | komzu'e | combs korcu | is bent | krogau | bends krefu | repeats | refygau | causes to recur kunti | is empty | kutygau | vacates gapru | is above | lafti | lifts lunbe | is bare | lubgau | denudes manku | is dark | mangau | darkens mapti | fits | matygau | matches muvdu | is in motion | muvgau | moves selnupre | is a promise | nupre | promises pagre | penetrates | gregau | causes to penetrate panlo | is a slice | panlyzba | slices pijne | is a pin | pijnylasna | pins pindi | is poor | pidgau | impoverishes preti | is a question | retsku/tese preti | asks a question preja | expands | pejgau | spreads cpana | is on | punji | puts on/at zvati | at | punji | puts on/at punli | is a swelling | pulgau | swells ranji | lasts | ranjygau | causes to last (makes lasting) ranti | is soft | rangau | softens ricfu | is rich | cfugau | enriches panzi | offspring | rorci | procreates viknu | is thick | viknygau | thickens ruble | is weak | blegau | weakens runme | is melting | rumgau | makes melt runta | dissolves | runtygau | makes dissolve sepli | is apart | fendi | divides nenri | is within | setca | inserts jbini | is between | setca | interposes spoja | explodes | pojgau | blows up sraku | is sharp | rakygau | scratches sudga | is dry | sudgau | dries off sutra | is fast | sutygau | hastens tcena | stretches | tengau | extends terpa | fears | tepygau | frightenss tinsa | is stiff | tensygau | stiffens titla | is sweet | titygau | sweetens tordu | is short | torgau | shortens tsali | is strong | tsagau | strengthens tsapi | ia a spice | tsapygau | seasons vasru | contains | vasygau | encloses vlipa | is powerful | vligau | empowers vreji | is a record of | rejgau | records vrusi | is a flavor | vusyga'e | tastes panci | is an odor | sumne | smells zasti | exists | zbasu | creates zekri | is a crime | zerzukte | commits a crime zifre | is free | zifygau | liberates || (There are doubtless others.) * The place structure of ''xruti'' has changed during its history... ** A note [http://66.111.43.200/~jkominek/nuzban/wiki/index.php?Gismu%20list%20errata|here] says (1994) that ''xruti'' was to become non-agentive, although it remains agentive on the ''gismu'' lists of 9-6-94. ** I will have to check my notes, but IIRC the non-agentive meaning was changed to the present agentive at about the same time as the Great Rafsi Shift. * Lojban distinguishes ((forms of causation))...One could extend the foregoing series with ''each of the others''. * One must also consider the "hidden doers", those with non-x1 agent places: ** ''smuni'' has meaning---------------''tersmu'' interprets ** ''tatpi'' is tired------------------''seltatpi'' tires ** ''fengu'' is angry------------------''selfengu'' angers ** ''torni'' is twisting---------------''seltorni'' twists ** ''xalni'' is panicked---------------''selxalni'' terrifies ** ''zgike'' is music------------------''selzgi'' makes music ---- That's a very useful list. We shouldn't overlook the usefulness of ''zil-'', though: ;''zilsti'' comes to a stop :''sisti'' halts (or ''dicra'' interrupts) ;''zilxru'' reverts :''xruti'' restores ;''zilcatra'' dies :''catra'' kills ;''zilcfipu'' is confused :''cfipu'' confuses --((And)) * Wouldn't "is killed" be better as a translation than "dies"? That is, there has to be a killer or there isn't really any ''catra''ing involved. I'd use ''mrobi'o'' (become dead) for just plain dying "without a cause". (And I'm not sure whether consensus was reached on the usage of ''zil-'' in this manner. ''xu la .andban. lojbo?'') --mi'e ((pne|filip)) * It's a reasonable suspicion to have when I say something, but in this instance it's pretty uncontroversial, at least among the jboskepre. (I can't speak for nonjboskpre, since I don't get to hear their relevant views.)