Nth letter of the alphabet Posted by PierreAbbat on Mon 16 of Jun, 2008 06:02 GMT posts: 324 Use this thread to discuss the Nth letter of the alphabet page.
Posted by PierreAbbat on Mon 16 of Jun, 2008 06:01 GMT posts: 324 When numbering the letters of the Lojban alphabet, what number is assigned to "a"? Do we start "y'y, abu, by", or "y'y, slaka bu, denpa bu, abu"? Pierre To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to lojban-list-request@lojban.org with the subject unsubscribe, or go to http://www.lojban.org/lsg2/, or if you're really stuck, send mail to secretary@lojban.org for help.
Posted by Minimiscience on Mon 16 of Jun, 2008 06:01 GMT posts: 3588 On Apr 26, 2008, at 4:36 PM, Pierre Abbat wrote: > When numbering the letters of the Lojban alphabet, what number is > assigned > to "a"? Do we start "y'y, abu, by", or "y'y, slaka bu, denpa bu, abu"? I don't know of any official ordering yet, but I would simply use the ASCII one. Of course, you then have to decide whether to start counting at zero or one, so <.abu> could be either <lo vomoi> or <lo cimoi>. mu'omi'e la'o gy. Minimiscience .gy. To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to lojban-list-request@lojban.org with the subject unsubscribe, or go to http://www.lojban.org/lsg2/, or if you're really stuck, send mail to secretary@lojban.org for help.
Posted by lojbab on Mon 16 of Jun, 2008 06:01 GMT posts: 162 Pierre Abbat wrote: > When numbering the letters of the Lojban alphabet, what number is assigned > to "a"? Do we start "y'y, abu, by", or "y'y, slaka bu, denpa bu, abu"? The obvious answer is probably a non-answer to you, but very Lojbanic. a is the a'th letter of the alphabet, and y'y is the y'y'th letter of the alphabet. Since we have defined no official order (in fact we haven't defined what lerfu constitute the "Lojban alphabet"), that is really all that can be said. Alternatively, if you insist on a real order, and can define the members of the Lojban alphabet, the order is whatever order a generic sort engine will sort them as, presumably ASCII order for the symbols in question. lojbab To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to lojban-list-request@lojban.org with the subject unsubscribe, or go to http://www.lojban.org/lsg2/, or if you're really stuck, send mail to secretary@lojban.org for help.
Posted by Anonymous on Mon 16 of Jun, 2008 06:01 GMT On 4/26/08, Pierre Abbat <phma@phma.optus.nu> wrote: > When numbering the letters of the Lojban alphabet, what number is assigned > to "a"? Do we start "y'y, abu, by", or "y'y, slaka bu, denpa bu, abu"? I would not count slaka bu as a letter of the Lojban alphabet, on the grounds that it does not represent any Lojban phoneme. It's more like a symbol like "?", "!", or even the use of capital letters, which may have its meaning but is not strictly a part of the alphabet. As for dictionary order, I would prefer to ignore denpa bu (so that {.e} cames after {fa}, not before as in ASCII, and almost ignore y'y, using it only to put the vowel pair after the diphthong it breaks, so I prefer the order "at au a'u av" rather than the ASCII "a'u at au av". As for the actual numbering question, given that the Lojban alphabet is an extension of a reduced Latin alphabet, I would put them at the end of the alphabet, so abu is the first letter, as usual, and y'y and denpa bu the last two (in whatever order). mu'o mi'e xorxes To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to lojban-list-request@lojban.org with the subject unsubscribe, or go to http://www.lojban.org/lsg2/, or if you're really stuck, send mail to secretary@lojban.org for help.
Posted by PierreAbbat on Mon 16 of Jun, 2008 06:02 GMT posts: 324 When numbering the letters of the Lojban alphabet, what number is assigned to "a"? Do we start "y'y, abu, by", or "y'y, slaka bu, denpa bu, abu"? Pierre To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to lojban-list-request@lojban.org with the subject unsubscribe, or go to http://www.lojban.org/lsg2/, or if you're really stuck, send mail to secretary@lojban.org for help.
Posted by lojbab on Mon 16 of Jun, 2008 06:02 GMT posts: 162 Pierre Abbat wrote: > When numbering the letters of the Lojban alphabet, what number is assigned > to "a"? Do we start "y'y, abu, by", or "y'y, slaka bu, denpa bu, abu"? The obvious answer is probably a non-answer to you, but very Lojbanic. a is the a'th letter of the alphabet, and y'y is the y'y'th letter of the alphabet. Since we have defined no official order (in fact we haven't defined what lerfu constitute the "Lojban alphabet"), that is really all that can be said. Alternatively, if you insist on a real order, and can define the members of the Lojban alphabet, the order is whatever order a generic sort engine will sort them as, presumably ASCII order for the symbols in question. lojbab To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to lojban-list-request@lojban.org with the subject unsubscribe, or go to http://www.lojban.org/lsg2/, or if you're really stuck, send mail to secretary@lojban.org for help.
Posted by Anonymous on Mon 16 of Jun, 2008 06:02 GMT On 4/26/08, Pierre Abbat <phma@phma.optus.nu> wrote: > > When numbering the letters of the Lojban alphabet, what number is assigned > to "a"? Do we start "y'y, abu, by", or "y'y, slaka bu, denpa bu, abu"? > I agree with the other posters that ASCII is officially unofficial. (And some other sort would need some damn good explanation in order to justify making us write custom alphabetizing code from now until the end of time, wouldn't it?!) If I was "numbering" them as in calling them "lo (whatever)moi lerfu", it would seem much more reasonable to me to call the first one "pamoi" and not "nomoi", whatever that means. ni'o ta'o zo'o Last night on #ninpre I suggested we could add Q into Lojban as a silent letter. You could insert it anywhere you wanted to make words look stylish, like "cilreq" or "cusqku", without changing the way they sound. mu'o mi'e .bret.
Posted by Anonymous on Mon 16 of Jun, 2008 06:02 GMT On 4/26/08, Pierre Abbat <phma@phma.optus.nu> wrote: > When numbering the letters of the Lojban alphabet, what number is assigned > to "a"? Do we start "y'y, abu, by", or "y'y, slaka bu, denpa bu, abu"? I would not count slaka bu as a letter of the Lojban alphabet, on the grounds that it does not represent any Lojban phoneme. It's more like a symbol like "?", "!", or even the use of capital letters, which may have its meaning but is not strictly a part of the alphabet. As for dictionary order, I would prefer to ignore denpa bu (so that {.e} cames after {fa}, not before as in ASCII, and almost ignore y'y, using it only to put the vowel pair after the diphthong it breaks, so I prefer the order "at au a'u av" rather than the ASCII "a'u at au av". As for the actual numbering question, given that the Lojban alphabet is an extension of a reduced Latin alphabet, I would put them at the end of the alphabet, so abu is the first letter, as usual, and y'y and denpa bu the last two (in whatever order). mu'o mi'e xorxes To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to lojban-list-request@lojban.org with the subject unsubscribe, or go to http://www.lojban.org/lsg2/, or if you're really stuck, send mail to secretary@lojban.org for help.
Posted by Anonymous on Mon 16 of Jun, 2008 06:02 GMT On 4/28/08, Jorge LlambÃas <jjllambias@gmail.com> wrote: > > (so that > {.e} cames after {fa}, not before as in ASCII, That should have been {da}, of course. mu'o mi'e xorxes To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to lojban-list-request@lojban.org with the subject unsubscribe, or go to http://www.lojban.org/lsg2/, or if you're really stuck, send mail to secretary@lojban.org for help.
